Post by voice on May 12, 2016 16:44:19 GMT
May 12, 2016 5:29:02 GMT LmL said:
voice - Regarding the direction of cultural transmission, and many other topics, such as your eclipse-only model and others, many of the answers I would give are contained in my first 3 essays / podcasts, and since you already told me you were about to go back and listen to those, perhaps it makes more sense to circle back to these issues, at least after you listen to one and two.If they are the same as your first two essays at the W, then I have read them before I believe. But I will be downloading the podcasts today. I have a commute later and unfortunately Roy Dotrice still has not recorded Arianne II.
sigh...
May 12, 2016 5:29:02 GMT LmL said:
The second one in particular deals with the nuts and bolts of why I think the true cause of the LN came from the east, and the solution happened up North. You'll notice that in Westeros, they have no myth about what caused the LN. Nothing. Not one story - at least, they do have many accounts of moon meteors disguised as things like falling hammers, thunderbolts, and sea dragons, and divine tsunamis, but these are not officially connected to the cause of the Long Night. According to Westerosi legend, it just happened, and then the Others came. What I have found is that the East is full of origin stories about the Long Night - the Qarthine origin of dragons / moon cracking story and the Lightbringer moon cracking story, primarily - some of which are disguised as LN cure stories. That's kind of the heart of my research, at least for the first few episodes, uncovering the truth behind the Azor Ahai / Lightbringer myth. That truth indicates the entire story is about creating the problem. The celestial analog to the events say the same thing. What none of it really says is how the thing was ended. A woman with a monkeys tail did something which nobody can remember? The Rhoynar got the turtle and crab God to sing a song? That's about it. What we have in Westeros are detailed myths about the effects of the Long Night and end of the Long Night. I am certainly familiar with many of your interpretations on these subjects. And while I am a fan, and often marvel at the amount of detail you are able to recall and integrate, I do have some fundamental differences of opinion. I've only ever seen but one moon in my head-canon, and so, it is hard for me to accept a moon's destruction and the resulting moon meteors you describe. I can imagine it, and do when you are describing one of the processes, but I view the text differently.
You may well be right about Azor Ahai and Lightbringer, and as I told you in your first Astronomy thread, I quite hope you are. I would really like for there to be physical explanations for the Long Night, as opposed to magical. But I do think that GRRM has employed such laws to merely make his fantasy more plausible. It is still fantasy, and unfortunately, I think "magic" is at the root of many of these questions.
Still, even with my disagreements, I do enjoy your research and the many details you connect. I can certainly see how you may be right regarding AA and LB, but I do differ in terms of approach.
May 12, 2016 5:29:02 GMT LmL said:
There's other angles to it to, like the question of where advanced steel making technology for making Dawn or Lightbringer comes from - hint hint, it was the dawn age dragonlords, methinks - and the general patterns of cultural transmission (east to west) and a few others, but again, Insay we circle back after you check out those episodes.Ah, that reminds me. I would be very interested to hear your thoughts on the Vows of the Night's Watch thread in general, and this post specifically:
www.thelasthearth.com/post/33231/thread
You're tagged in it, so if you search the page for lml, you'll see the part I'm talking about.
Dawn may be the result of advanced steel making technology, but I don't think it is. It predates such methods, and is not steel at all -- in my interpretation, at least.
May 12, 2016 5:29:02 GMT LmL said:
Really glad you are enjoying so far! I am. You've done a nice job. Very obvious you are familiar with audio engineering and the medium suits you. I did radio in college because it sounded fun, but it was a lot harder than I realized it would be once I got in the studio.
May 12, 2016 5:34:35 GMT LmL said:
voice that scene your broke down at Storm's End is one of my favorites and I agree with some of your ideas here,but I'd really have to get in the weeds on the whole chapter and a few concepts I haven't even talked about public ally yet... and I am running very short on time, unfortunately.
We can break analyze the entire chapter, but we should definitely do that in Forensic Files. Speaking of which, there are a lot of really interesting threads there that I have a feeling you would enjoy.
May 12, 2016 5:34:35 GMT LmL said:
I will say that I agree that NK was a stag man, a horned lord perhaps you might say, although I don't know if we mean the same thing by that. I surely see the oldghosts fleeing from the rising sun, yes. Thing is, Lightbringer was forged earlier that night, in the darkness, with a blck shadowsword and a blood sacrifice. That sacrificed stag man then appeared transformed and resurrection as a fiery stag man leading a host of demons in steel. So... there's a bit more to the story.
I can see NK as a Horned Lord (and a horny Lord Commander), but yes, we probably view that aspect a bit differently.
Glad we agree on the ghosts fleeing the rising sun. You may be surprised that I agree with you, and yes, Lightbringer was forged earlier that night. In fact, I would argue, Lightbringer can only be forged at night because that is when the sun (a star) has fallen beneath the horizon (starfall).
Every night forges Lightbringer, as only darkness can bring Dawn.