Weirdly, this is not at all a concern to Dany, which does make some sense, but it should probably bother Jon! Then they had to make out like it was lunch time on the football field. So awkward to watch, probably because their chemistry is poor and it's unbelievable that they love one another.
I loved how that got thrown in on the sly, but no one knows what the shit is going on at Storm's End, or where Euron's fleet is. Also, didn't we see Elleria last in a dungeon in KL? Is she still there or what?
ETA: Shades of Robb's ignoring Grey Wind. Red Wedding redux?? At this point, I'd welcome it.
Yes, it seems like it! But at this point, I don't see a Jon/Dany wedding happening. BTW, I think last season, Jon promised not to call Daenerys Dany, and now this season he calls her that all the time. And it's super annoying how Kit says "Dan-ee"!
What's up with Bran making it Jon's choice, though? He made Sam tell Jon, but he didn't make Jon tell his sisters. Is this some sort of 3EC dice-roll?
This just seems like another great big glaring pot hole. Bran insisted Sam tell Jon (because Bran was to busy to do it himself?) before the battle with the Night King, except nothing Jon did in that battle mattered with his parentage at all. Heck, he had already rode a dragon before Sam told him, so that's not the reason, either. Then, suddenly, Bran's like "it's up to you", which seems stupid! And then to just cut away from the revelation for Arya and Sansa in that scene was also annoying.
What would have been more satisfying with regards to Missandei is if she had said her words and then before she could be beheaded, jumped--dying on her own terms--showing that though she may be back in chains, she has power over whether she lives or dies and she will choose how she dies.
I actually thought she was going to jump! Yes, agreed, it would have made her more powerful by taking the choice from Cersei, but we have to have Dany beyond hair-pulling, cat-fight mad at Cersei, so... At least it was a quick, clean death, and not being skinned alive or set on fire!
Their father understood as well. "You want no pup for yourself, Jon?" he asked softly.
I was on the hate train last week, but this week was good. It was good!
It has THEMES. The Starks, Cersei, and Dany are all driven by the destruction of their families. Dany becomes downright tragic, and even makes different faces! Seriously, Dany's impending tragedy is so much better written than the NK storyline. It isn't even close. And they finally reined in Emilia Clarke's eyebrows. You guys are crazy. They actually bothered setting up events, and they did so in a plausible, entertaining way.
It did have the attempt of some theme work, but I am disliking the name of the episode, based on what happened in it. Bran is rejecting Winterfell, Sansa covet's it like a greedy schemer, Jon don't give two shits, and Arya be like "I ain't coming back". Should have named the episode, "the death of Winterfell and 8000 years of Stark's who gave a shit". I did like where they are taking Dany's character but Cersei is still totally one dimensional, they are writing Jon as cold and dull as possible. They tore down Jaime's arc in a heart beat, while they made Brienne cry like a bitch over her boy friend. And even with all of that, it was a much better episode than last week, perhaps just because we could see it. And there was dialogue between the characters which is really how character's develop or are tarnished.
I actually quite liked that Tyrion marched up to Cersei and tried to appeal to her. Although we knew it was going to fail, so I am not sure what the point is. I also don't know why Tyrion seems to care so much about what happens to the city of King's Landing? Worried about the whores, I guess! If he at least made some acknowledgment that he was worried about pots and pots of wild fire that would explode if the city was attacked, but there is nothing in relation to that concern.
I like Gilly. She's that slightly plump girl next door who you can not only totally get with but really enjoy the time spent together. Real marriage material IMO. Good mom, too.
I don't think people hate Gilly. I like book Gilly quite fine, but this show character is written like she is a bit delayed. I am not trying to be mean but that is either how she interprets the character or that she was told to act the character. Maybe it's because her father was also her baby daddy and her mother is probably also her sister... but it's annoying, either way.
Well, Sansa got her wolf killed in like 5 minutes, and then her father 10 minutes later, so... Better go with Tormund!
Bahahaha! Okay, Sansa doesn't probably need Ghost!! But the idea that a direwolf has no place south of Winterfell is already false in the show, since Nymeria is flourishing in the riverlands. Maybe Ghost could have hung out with her and had incest pups with his litter mate?
I'm fine with Dany's story arc because I've always predicted the end of the targ as a leading powerhouse. I mean, you can't break the wheel if you maintain the same political regime which lead the 7 kingdoms into chaos... and the targaryens were part of it. It must ends, somehow.
This is why I wanted to call bullshit on Dany naming Gendry a Baratheon AND the Lord of Storms End. If she really wanted to "break the wheel" she would give Storm's End to someone who had earned it, and not to someone just because they are the last blood line of the family. That IS the fooking wheel she wants to break!
Of course, Dany's honor to Gendry is more about manipulation as well as making herself look benevolent. Notice she didn't name Sam the Lord of Horn Hill but of course, she thinks he is plotting against her. Hard to say if the Tarly family still holds Horn Hill after Dany torched Randyll and Dickon.
(particularly loved the 'brother, not half brother, not bastard brother' line)
I loved this line from Arya. I am trying to disengage from the books but this felt very organic and also a call back to the relationship between Book Jon and Book Arya!
This theme keeps popping up but it was just last season (okay two years but...) that Jon told Theon he could be both Greyjoy and Stark and Theon doesn't even have Stark blood. But Jon is half fooking Stark but he is "not a Stark". This writing is so shitty!
Did any of you catch the Starbucks goof? I did not catch it, but I did have a good chuckle over it. I understand that it has been edited out now.
I totally seen a meme of this on FB this morning and thought WTF! How embarrassing for the crew and the director! But I guess these things do happen in film and tv and it's not the end of the world. But in this case, with the show catching such heat, this just looks so sloppy!
Their father understood as well. "You want no pup for yourself, Jon?" he asked softly.
I just have to say that while my expectations were lowered after 8.3, I didn't hate 8.4, and I am kind of shocked at how bad the response has been. IMDB is currently rating this episode at 6.6, which would be the lowest episode in show history, and Rotten Tomatoes is currently a splat at 58%. Honestly, it wasn't that bad! I don't know if this is just a response to how jerked off people are beginning to feel in general, or just the response to Jon Show (yes, that's right) being a dick weed to Ghost or that fact that Rhaegal died from heat seeking ballista's while Drogon has invisible plot armor strapped all over him. Share some armor with your bro, Drogon!!
Now it looks like they killed Missandei so that they would have justification for making Dany the Mad Queen. I FUCKING HATE THAT. D&D have teased this for so long, but it really just shows how they don't understand Daenerys at all and that they probably skimmed through the Meereen chapters. I felt so sorry for her in this episode.
No, they don't. It's not believable at all. I have some beefs with Dany doing a regime change in Astapor and then just walks away, but in Mereen she realizes that doesn't work and chooses to stay. And that's what I like about her character, when it doesn't turn out how she expected, she takes responsibility.
i'm in the minority in this, but i thought what Jon did for Ghost was very selfless, and was not abandoning the wolf at all. Jon is going to Kings Landing, and even though he's not a stark, he's expecting to die. Tormund is heading back home, where women like him (oh did my Brimund heart break for the fellow, but i'm glad the northern girls aren't all scared of the Giantsbabe), and Ghost is at home in the far North, and the last thing Jon wants for Ghost after getting super gnarly fucked up by the army of the dead, is to die south of the neck like Lady or Grey Wind. Much better to let him go with Tormund who will take care of Ghost in honor of his King who went south... Loved the Jon Tormund Sam scene in its entirety, and i'm also not annoyed with Gilly at all. i like her character portrayal and think she'll turn into an awesome Lady Tarly.
I think people react to how cold he was toward Ghost. Couldn't even give him a pat on the head, or ruffle his fur, or anything. And they are supposed to be really close. I don't remember the earlier seasons so well, but didn't he say goodbye to Ghost before climbing the Wall in the show as in the books?
Weirdly, this is not at all a concern to Dany, which does make some sense, but it should probably bother Jon! Then they had to make out like it was lunch time on the football field. So awkward to watch, probably because their chemistry is poor and it's unbelievable that they love one another.
They don't have the lovers chemistry at all. Imo they could barely have pulled off friends with benefits.
Yes, it seems like it! But at this point, I don't see a Jon/Dany wedding happening. BTW, I think last season, Jon promised not to call Daenerys Dany, and now this season he calls her that all the time. And it's super annoying how Kit says "Dan-ee"!
Haha, I thought he's started calling her Donnie? So technically he's keeping his promise, if so.
Tragic what just happened to Jaime's growth arc... like someone popped a hole in a balloon! PPfftt and then it's over!
Just like they did with Sansa and Theon... It's one thing for a redemption/growth arc to go a bit back and forth, but they do it in a way that is just cringe.
Or perhaps Brienne was just really really bad in bed...
And even with all of that, it was a much better episode than last week, perhaps just because we could see it.
Speaking of last episode. OotGH does a Night's Watch on Mondays, and the one for ep. 3 Quinn from Ideas of Ice and Fire joined in. And at one point he has an epic rant on how bad the episode was, after getting poo-pooed for being too negative. It was hillarious!
Bahahaha! Okay, Sansa doesn't probably need Ghost!! But the idea that a direwolf has no place south of Winterfell is already false in the show, since Nymeria is flourishing in the riverlands. Maybe Ghost could have hung out with her and had incest pups with his litter mate?
Haha, #NoDirewolfForSansa
You know, if Ghost joined up with Nymeria, it would be an interesting parallell to the Night's King (the book version that is).
This is why I wanted to call bullshit on Dany naming Gendry a Baratheon AND the Lord of Storms End. If she really wanted to "break the wheel" she would give Storm's End to someone who had earned it, and not to someone just because they are the last blood line of the family. That IS the fooking wheel she wants to break!
Hey! Now you are remembering things from other episodes! D&D doesn't do that shit. They work under the rule of always forgetting what you've previously written. As this is a different episode, not to mention another season, the wheel is back on the table.
No, they don't. It's not believable at all. I have some beefs with Dany doing a regime change in Astapor and then just walks away, but in Mereen she realizes that doesn't work and chooses to stay. And that's what I like about her character, when it doesn't turn out how she expected, she takes responsibility.
Dave and Dan are playing with the mad queen in several places in their version of the story. Cersei burning down the Sept along with thousands of innocents with no protest from anyone at all, really. Dany on this current turn of her anger at the loss of her friend and dragon/child, but of course, even if those are justified anger and she is not truly mad, Dany might never escape the fear of madness, simply because of who her father is. Cersei is going to fill the Red Keep with a million people I guess, and let them starve, while Dany is going to murder half of those people to attempt to kill Cersei, so it's mad queen for both of them.
I think they even played with this "madness" in Sansa, even though she is no queen, with her motivations around the BotB and feeding Ramsay to his own dogs, when toying with the idea of cruelty vs madness.
In the books though, there are hints of anger making Dany due impulsive things that are both cruel as well as poor political choices (hello, Aerys), like the crucifixion of the Master's. Cersei is toyed with in the books in this way, and I think even Selyse has flairs of "mad queen" about her, perhaps she is most fitting of all. This is a trope that GRRM is playing with to different extremes with different characters. The show is trying to play too...
As for the show, they seem to be writing Dany as mad, Cersei as hateful (and perhaps mad), Jon as "stupid but everyone loves him anyway even though he's a bad pet owner". Their version is like the kindergarten version of complexity all of a sudden.
I think people react to how cold he was toward Ghost. Couldn't even give him a pat on the head, or ruffle his fur, or anything. And they are supposed to be really close. I don't remember the earlier seasons so well, but didn't he say goodbye to Ghost before climbing the Wall in the show as in the books?
Apparently the show is using CGI budget as a reason/excuse for this, and I suppose it is more expensive to show Jon touching Ghost, but they must have known how this was going to be perceived when watching it. Like Jon Snow is an asshole to his most loyal companion. Okay, if it's expensive to CGI Jon petting Ghost, they could at least have had an exchange of some sort, a whispered word or something. Instead Tormund gets a hug, Sam gets a hug, Gilly gets a hug, and in direct contrast in the very same scene, one-eared scorched Ghost gets not one damn thing. But this is an example of the show just not connecting on some basic level anymore.
Speaking of last episode. OotGH does a Night's Watch on Mondays, and the one for ep. 3 Quinn from Ideas of Ice and Fire joined in. And at one point he has an epic rant on how bad the episode was, after getting poo-pooed for being too negative. It was hillarious!
I have been watching Quinn's Idea's channel and he started out really chill, not trying to shit on the show, and he came across as a bit robotic, but that changed with episode 3. He is now just calling out the bullshit, which I enjoy, and the real him is back in his voice. I haven't watched any of the green hand stuff this year.
Hey! Now you are remembering things from other episodes! D&D doesn't do that shit. They work under the rule of always forgetting what you've previously written. As this is a different episode, not to mention another season, the wheel is back on the table.
One thing Dany did do when she named Gendry the Lord of Storms End, a legal Baratheon and tied him publicly to being the son of Robert Baratheon,the former king, is she might have lined him up for the throne. When this story started, Robert was king and the conflict started over the succession after his death. Joff and Tommen both held the throne based on them being Robert's heirs (even if not by blood), and now we have Gendry, a legal and blood heir to Robert, King of Westeros. Cersei is holding the throne based on that fact that she claimed the throne after Tommen's death, but the show always did a shitty job of explaining that. If she is overthrown, which she will probably be, and Dany and Jon cannot or will not claim the throne, suddenly Gendry looks like a great possibility! Maybe that is where the show is going. It's interesting to me that the show never showed Gendry bending the knee to Daenerys, nor have him refer to her as his leader.
The only twist might be if the show decides to go with Cersei is Gendry's mother, and he is the one who takes her down.
Actually, I like the new character and I wish he had arrived sooner this season. I LOL'd every time! However, I would also enjoy a revved up ballista catching him mid-chest out of nowhere just for shock value!
Their father understood as well. "You want no pup for yourself, Jon?" he asked softly.
I think people react to how cold he was toward Ghost. Couldn't even give him a pat on the head, or ruffle his fur, or anything. And they are supposed to be really close. I don't remember the earlier seasons so well, but didn't he say goodbye to Ghost before climbing the Wall in the show as in the books?
budget reasons. CGI a wold across the yard from him is way easier than having real life actor interact with the CGI. Ghost isn't integral to dumb and dumber's version of the character, far more important to get him riding a dragon with the CGI budget...
Dave and Dan are playing with the mad queen in several places in their version of the story. Cersei burning down the Sept along with thousands of innocents with no protest from anyone at all, really. Dany on this current turn of her anger at the loss of her friend and dragon/child, but of course, even if those are justified anger and she is not truly mad, Dany might never escape the fear of madness, simply because of who her father is. Cersei is going to fill the Red Keep with a million people I guess, and let them starve, while Dany is going to murder half of those people to attempt to kill Cersei, so it's mad queen for both of them.
I think they even played with this "madness" in Sansa, even though she is no queen, with her motivations around the BotB and feeding Ramsay to his own dogs, when toying with the idea of cruelty vs madness.
In the books though, there are hints of anger making Dany due impulsive things that are both cruel as well as poor political choices (hello, Aerys), like the crucifixion of the Master's. Cersei is toyed with in the books in this way, and I think even Selyse has flairs of "mad queen" about her, perhaps she is most fitting of all. This is a trope that GRRM is playing with to different extremes with different characters. The show is trying to play too...
Sure, I see that. I'm just not convinced by their writing. Perhaps if they used more time on it, but they aren't really good writers at all.
Maybe they'll have an episode called "The Mad Queen" with all three of them, so we can wonder about which one is the mad queen. Like with the title for "The Mystery Knight" which has several mystery knights. But that might be overestimating their IQs...
As for the show, they seem to be writing Dany as mad, Cersei as hateful (and perhaps mad), Jon as "stupid but everyone loves him anyway even though he's a bad pet owner". Their version is like the kindergarten version of complexity all of a sudden.
Hahaha! They can't make it without George holding their hands!
Apparently the show is using CGI budget as a reason/excuse for this, and I suppose it is more expensive to show Jon touching Ghost, but they must have known how this was going to be perceived when watching it. Like Jon Snow is an asshole to his most loyal companion. Okay, if it's expensive to CGI Jon petting Ghost, they could at least have had an exchange of some sort, a whispered word or something. Instead Tormund gets a hug, Sam gets a hug, Gilly gets a hug, and in direct contrast in the very same scene, one-eared scorched Ghost gets not one damn thing. But this is an example of the show just not connecting on some basic level anymore.
budget reasons. CGI a wold across the yard from him is way easier than having real life actor interact with the CGI. Ghost isn't integral to dumb and dumber's version of the character, far more important to get him riding a dragon with the CGI budget...
They say it's budged, but I hear they had money for a working brewery, a functioning smithy, and hand carved (!) bowls for Winterfell. The brewery I can get, but the other stuff? I just don't buy it if that is true.
So if this is the case, I'd say they are making it clear that there is no Jon Snow, nor Jon Stark. We now have Aejon Targaryen, bender of knees, giver of kingdoms, banger of aunt, empty of mind, and deserter of Ghost.
And yes, if George does something similar in his books when the parentage is revealed, I'd react negative as well!
I have been watching Quinn's Idea's channel and he started out really chill, not trying to shit on the show, and he came across as a bit robotic, but that changed with episode 3. He is now just calling out the bullshit, which I enjoy, and the real him is back in his voice. I haven't watched any of the green hand stuff this year.
I haven't watched him. Originally I was planning on just watching Preston, then I was recommended his pre-show with Carmine and Phil TheIssuesGuy and started watching those as well. And one Tuesday morning the Order was streaming when I got up, so I put it on. With their two regular guests, Mike and Jon, it was just hilarious and I had to watch them all! Jon has the driest humor ever!
I did post the video with the timestamp leading up to his outbursts (it was two) in the ep.3 thread. It lasts max 5 minutes. I laughed so hard!
One thing Dany did do when she named Gendry the Lord of Storms End, a legal Baratheon and tied him publicly to being the son of Robert Baratheon,the former king, is she might have lined him up for the throne. When this story started, Robert was king and the conflict started over the succession after his death. Joff and Tommen both held the throne based on them being Robert's heirs (even if not by blood), and now we have Gendry, a legal and blood heir to Robert, King of Westeros. Cersei is holding the throne based on that fact that she claimed the throne after Tommen's death, but the show always did a shitty job of explaining that. If she is overthrown, which she will probably be, and Dany and Jon cannot or will not claim the throne, suddenly Gendry looks like a great possibility! Maybe that is where the show is going. It's interesting to me that the show never showed Gendry bending the knee to Daenerys, nor have him refer to her as his leader.
Well, yes. But will they remember that as well? Haha, I keep asking that, because it seems like they are total newbees that are just dropped in to write an episode without knowing anything other than the characters names sometimes!
But I guess it would be possible that they are setting something up for the last moment or something.
Actually, I like the new character and I wish he had arrived sooner this season. I LOL'd every time! However, I would also enjoy a revved up ballista catching him mid-chest out of nowhere just for shock value!
Me too! He's been going in repeats in my head since I saw it!
Sure, I see that. I'm just not convinced by their writing. Perhaps if they used more time on it, but they aren't really good writers at all.
Maybe they'll have an episode called "The Mad Queen" with all three of them, so we can wonder about which one is the mad queen. Like with the title for "The Mystery Knight" which has several mystery knights. But that might be overestimating their IQs...
I will pee myself laughing if that is the name of the next episode. Hahaha!
They say it's budged, but I hear they had money for a working brewery, a functioning smithy, and hand carved (!) bowls for Winterfell. The brewery I can get, but the other stuff? I just don't buy it if that is true.
So if this is the case, I'd say they are making it clear that there is no Jon Snow, nor Jon Stark. We now have Aejon Targaryen, bender of knees, giver of kingdoms, banger of aunt, empty of mind, and deserter of Ghost.
"Aejon" has no dragon, either! Too bad Mel is dead, perhaps she could have said some prayers and trimmed the dragon's horns and he could have come back, a la Jon Show!
I haven't watched him. Originally I was planning on just watching Preston, then I was recommended his pre-show with Carmine and Phil TheIssuesGuy and started watching those as well. And one Tuesday morning the Order was streaming when I got up, so I put it on. With their two regular guests, Mike and Jon, it was just hilarious and I had to watch them all! Jon has the driest humor ever!
Carmine seems like more of a show yes man, but Preston's take and humor I quite enjoy. I used to give Red Team Review a watch every now and then, but that was several years ago.
Haha! I'll go for the end game that this Jon, my current favorite reviewer, thinks: Tyrion will sit the Iron Throne.
I am not sure Tyrion deserves it, as he hasn't been very smart for a couple years now. Unless he has purposefully lead Dany to make terrible decisions that have annihilated nearly her whole invasion force.
Their father understood as well. "You want no pup for yourself, Jon?" he asked softly.
"Aejon" has no dragon, either! Too bad Mel is dead, perhaps she could have said some prayers and trimmed the dragon's horns and he could have come back, a la Jon Show!
Haha, some horn shavings and everything will be ok!
Carmine seems like more of a show yes man, but Preston's take and humor I quite enjoy. I used to give Red Team Review a watch every now and then, but that was several years ago.
I only watch Carmine with Preston, I haven't seen any of his other stuff. Except the one video he made with arrows and circles in the thumb nail for it, as they had just spoken about those types of videos shortly before that. So I had to watch it for that alone.
I don't really mind yes show people, as long as they don't turn into contortionists in an attempt to find logic in it. If they are critical when something is clearly stupid, they should say so. And Carmone does that.
I am not sure Tyrion deserves it, as he hasn't been very smart for a couple years now. Unless he has purposefully lead Dany to make terrible decisions that have annihilated nearly her whole invasion force.
Deserving it does not come into the question. If you can get it, and then hold it, it's yours. If not, you have to fight or back down.
And the theory goes that his advice has been so asinine to bleed Dany and Cersei off fighting each other, until he is left to take it himself.
Not saying I buy into that, but at least it would explain why Tyrion has become so utterly stupid since leaving King's Landing. And it would be kinda funny!
I don't really care who sits the throne in the end, except Cersei who should be removed. I'm quite like the smallfolk in these matters. And as I can't follow D&Ds thinking I don't even try to guess.