Post by Gwindor on May 27, 2016 6:25:33 GMT
The history of Robert's Rebellion is shrouded in mystery. In fact, we, as readers, only know several small fragments of the story, a constellation of little tidbits of information, which we try to interconnect to get a general picture of the events. As we know very little, we assume quite a lot.
Let us recall the events that led to the rebellion, as we know it:
- Brandon Stark learns that Rhaegar Targaryen kidnapped Lyanna, travels to King's Landing and demands her back (and Rhaegar dead);
- Aerys imprisons Brandon, summons Rickard to 'answer for his son's crimes', executes them both, then writes Jon Arryn demanding the heads of Eddard Stark and Robert Baratheon;
- Jon rallies his banners instead, and Ned and Robert depart to their domains to gather their own armies - a full-scale war begins.
So, apparently, it all began when Rhaegar abducted Lyanna (or they loved each other and ran away together), right? Not exactly. To be precise, everything began when Brandon appeared at the gates of King's Landing, shouting 'Rhaegar, come out and die'. For this to happen, strictly speaking, neither actual abduction nor actual elopement were necessary. All it took was Brandon's belief.
So, my point is: could Rhaegar have been framed? Could someone have just lied to Brandon, expecting the wild wolf to react rashly based on that rumor? My answer is: definitely possible. In fact, this is very like GRRM. See his other works, for instance, Dying of the Light, or Men of Greywater Station. And we've even seen similar examples in ASOIAF. Remember that for three first volumes, we've been led to believe that the Starks' actions that eventually led to the Wot5K were perfectly justified, because the Lannisters had murdered Jon Arryn. Except they didn't. They had committed many other crimes, sure, and the defenestration of Bran and subsequent assassination attempt by Joffrey played their roles as well, but everything actually began when Ned and Catelyn started to believe that the Lannisters murdered Jon, which they didn't.
What do we know for sure about Rhaegar and Lyanna during the rebellion?
About Rhaegar, we only know the following:
- He briefly talked with Jaime Lannister before departing the capital with an army to fight Robert at the Trident. Lyanna wasn't mentioned.
- He was killed by Robert during the battle.
Actually, that is all. And about Lyanna during the rebellion, we know absolutely nothing, except that she wasn't with her family, and around the time the war ended, she was dead.
Many characters believe the abduction did happen, but none of them actually saw it. The story is believable because of that damned crown of roses at Harrenhal. Note also, that ser Barristan once wondered whether the war could have been averted had he managed to unhorse Rhaegar in the final tilt of the tourney, and crown Ashara Dayne instead. But the rebellion happened two years later, and, according to the story we assume is true, was by no means the actual reason behind the rebellion. The abduction seems to be the actual reason, but if it never happened, then the incident with the crown is really to be blamed, in part, as it lent credence to the rumor about abduction.
When Brandon expressed his belief that Rhaegar had kidnapped Lyanna, many believed because everyone (and I mean almost literally, everyone, it was a grand tourney) saw him crown her instead of his wife.
This idea seems very interesting to me, however, I do admit it creates some problems.
What about the Tower of Joy, for example? Didn't Ned find Lyanna there, protected by the three Kingsguard? That's our guess as well, not something clearly stated by GRRM. In fact, the only time the tower is mentioned in the books is in the fever dream of Ned Stark. And I recall an SSM where GRRM said that the contents of that dream are not to be taken literally, as it is, well, a fever dream. Oh, the tower existed, sure. I even think we can be certain that Ned did visit it with his six friends and fought Dayne, Hightower, and Whent there. And he pulled it down afterwards, and used the stones to build eight cairns. But what was inside the tower, we don't know. Maybe in the dream, Ned jumps from the scene at the tower to the memories of Lyanna by association; maybe what happened at the tower reminds him somehow about his sister. It could even have been some emotional connection, not a connection of events.
What about R+L=J? If there was no R+L, who is Jon? I don't know. Perhaps son of Ashara Dayne, and the future Sword of the Morning? Or maybe he is son of Lyanna, just not of Rhaegar?
And who was inside the Tower of Joy if Lyanna wasn't there? Maybe queen Rhaella, giving birth to Daenerys? Maybe some other cloaked and hooded woman had been sent to Dragonstone as a decoy?
So, the theory apparently creates more problems than it solves. Still, total absence of any evidence Rhaegar ever as much as talked to Lyanna makes me curious and willing to speculate on this point.
What do you guys think?
Let us recall the events that led to the rebellion, as we know it:
- Brandon Stark learns that Rhaegar Targaryen kidnapped Lyanna, travels to King's Landing and demands her back (and Rhaegar dead);
- Aerys imprisons Brandon, summons Rickard to 'answer for his son's crimes', executes them both, then writes Jon Arryn demanding the heads of Eddard Stark and Robert Baratheon;
- Jon rallies his banners instead, and Ned and Robert depart to their domains to gather their own armies - a full-scale war begins.
So, apparently, it all began when Rhaegar abducted Lyanna (or they loved each other and ran away together), right? Not exactly. To be precise, everything began when Brandon appeared at the gates of King's Landing, shouting 'Rhaegar, come out and die'. For this to happen, strictly speaking, neither actual abduction nor actual elopement were necessary. All it took was Brandon's belief.
So, my point is: could Rhaegar have been framed? Could someone have just lied to Brandon, expecting the wild wolf to react rashly based on that rumor? My answer is: definitely possible. In fact, this is very like GRRM. See his other works, for instance, Dying of the Light, or Men of Greywater Station. And we've even seen similar examples in ASOIAF. Remember that for three first volumes, we've been led to believe that the Starks' actions that eventually led to the Wot5K were perfectly justified, because the Lannisters had murdered Jon Arryn. Except they didn't. They had committed many other crimes, sure, and the defenestration of Bran and subsequent assassination attempt by Joffrey played their roles as well, but everything actually began when Ned and Catelyn started to believe that the Lannisters murdered Jon, which they didn't.
What do we know for sure about Rhaegar and Lyanna during the rebellion?
About Rhaegar, we only know the following:
- He briefly talked with Jaime Lannister before departing the capital with an army to fight Robert at the Trident. Lyanna wasn't mentioned.
- He was killed by Robert during the battle.
Actually, that is all. And about Lyanna during the rebellion, we know absolutely nothing, except that she wasn't with her family, and around the time the war ended, she was dead.
Many characters believe the abduction did happen, but none of them actually saw it. The story is believable because of that damned crown of roses at Harrenhal. Note also, that ser Barristan once wondered whether the war could have been averted had he managed to unhorse Rhaegar in the final tilt of the tourney, and crown Ashara Dayne instead. But the rebellion happened two years later, and, according to the story we assume is true, was by no means the actual reason behind the rebellion. The abduction seems to be the actual reason, but if it never happened, then the incident with the crown is really to be blamed, in part, as it lent credence to the rumor about abduction.
When Brandon expressed his belief that Rhaegar had kidnapped Lyanna, many believed because everyone (and I mean almost literally, everyone, it was a grand tourney) saw him crown her instead of his wife.
This idea seems very interesting to me, however, I do admit it creates some problems.
What about the Tower of Joy, for example? Didn't Ned find Lyanna there, protected by the three Kingsguard? That's our guess as well, not something clearly stated by GRRM. In fact, the only time the tower is mentioned in the books is in the fever dream of Ned Stark. And I recall an SSM where GRRM said that the contents of that dream are not to be taken literally, as it is, well, a fever dream. Oh, the tower existed, sure. I even think we can be certain that Ned did visit it with his six friends and fought Dayne, Hightower, and Whent there. And he pulled it down afterwards, and used the stones to build eight cairns. But what was inside the tower, we don't know. Maybe in the dream, Ned jumps from the scene at the tower to the memories of Lyanna by association; maybe what happened at the tower reminds him somehow about his sister. It could even have been some emotional connection, not a connection of events.
What about R+L=J? If there was no R+L, who is Jon? I don't know. Perhaps son of Ashara Dayne, and the future Sword of the Morning? Or maybe he is son of Lyanna, just not of Rhaegar?
And who was inside the Tower of Joy if Lyanna wasn't there? Maybe queen Rhaella, giving birth to Daenerys? Maybe some other cloaked and hooded woman had been sent to Dragonstone as a decoy?
So, the theory apparently creates more problems than it solves. Still, total absence of any evidence Rhaegar ever as much as talked to Lyanna makes me curious and willing to speculate on this point.
What do you guys think?