I believe that he developed some serious abandonment issues after BR cast him aside. He considers himself to be a god, an Old God with their divine power. In his anger and resentment he's gathering priests to show his power over their religions.
YUP! That makes perfect sense. And, given the fight between brothers at the kings moot, I'm now harboring the mad flight of fancy that perhaps the Stark in Winterfell and the Night's King were rivals for power after the beginning of the Night's Watch. . . if so, might explain why the Night's King went so far. Not just to seek the magics (as does Euron) but also to assert his dominance over family (as Euron clearly does).
We're blatantly told that Euron is part human, part kracken. A kraken is the Greyjoy sigil.
And, like the Night's King, that he is seen as no longer human per se. A personal transformation into an "otherized" Greyjoy vs. an "Other" Stark???
All art is at once surface and symbol. Those who go beneath the surface do so at their peril. Those who read the symbol do so at their peril. It is the spectator, and not life, that art really mirrors. Oscar Wilde.
I believe that he developed some serious abandonment issues after BR cast him aside. He considers himself to be a god, an Old God with their divine power. In his anger and resentment he's gathering priests to show his power over their religions.
YUP! That makes perfect sense. And, given the fight between brothers at the kings moot, I'm now harboring the mad flight of fancy that perhaps the Stark in Winterfell and the Night's King were rivals for power after the beginning of the Night's Watch. . . if so, might explain why the Night's King went so far. Not just to seek the magics (as does Euron) but also to assert his dominance over family (as Euron clearly does).
I believe that he developed some serious abandonment issues after BR cast him aside. He considers himself to be a god, an Old God with their divine power. In his anger and resentment he's gathering priests to show his power over their religions.
YUP! That makes perfect sense. And, given the fight between brothers at the kings moot, I'm now harboring the mad flight of fancy that perhaps the Stark in Winterfell and the Night's King were rivals for power after the beginning of the Night's Watch. . . if so, might explain why the Night's King went so far. Not just to seek the magics (as does Euron) but also to assert his dominance over family (as Euron clearly does).
YUP! That makes perfect sense. And, given the fight between brothers at the kings moot, I'm now harboring the mad flight of fancy that perhaps the Stark in Winterfell and the Night's King were rivals for power after the beginning of the Night's Watch. . . if so, might explain why the Night's King went so far. Not just to seek the magics (as does Euron) but also to assert his dominance over family (as Euron clearly does).
That's an excellent idea. As much as we all love the Starks it's easy to think of each Lord being like Ned. IMO Old Nan was right and the NK was a Stark. Possibly even why they lost OID (Original Ice/Dawn).
The blade was Valyrian steel, spell-forged and dark as smoke. Nothing held an edge like Valyrian steel.
That's an excellent idea. As much as we all love the Starks it's easy to think of each Lord being like Ned. IMO Old Nan was right and the NK was a Stark. Possibly even why they lost OID (Original Ice/Dawn).
To push things possibly much too far: we have Ned's thoughts and even words that Winterfell was supposed to be for Brandon. And that Cat, the blue-eyed, milk-skinned bride, was supposed to be for Brandon.
Ned didn't usurp Brandon by any means. But he ended up the Stark in Winterfell when it should have gone to a Brandon. Since the Night's King was most likely named Brandon, and since it looks like there's a good chance that Ned's original heir will be supplanted by Jon-the -Unlikely--I'm wondering if we're seeing a version of history again replay.
Ohhhh, I like it! To quote the great Zazu from the Lion King, "there's one in every family; two in mine."
Lion King, Wolf King--it's all the same in a pack/pride.
All art is at once surface and symbol. Those who go beneath the surface do so at their peril. Those who read the symbol do so at their peril. It is the spectator, and not life, that art really mirrors. Oscar Wilde.
DarkSister1001--one other thing: we've got the more magical and possible greenseer-potential Euron fighting with Damphair and Vicatrion.
Both Bran and Jon seem much further along in their warging than Robb ever got, especially after he started disconnecting from Grey Wind.
So, am now wondering if the Night's King was the more powerful magically of the Starks--gave him power but made him necessary to be thrown down.
As Euron clearly MUST be thrown down if life as we know it has a chance to continue.
All art is at once surface and symbol. Those who go beneath the surface do so at their peril. Those who read the symbol do so at their peril. It is the spectator, and not life, that art really mirrors. Oscar Wilde.
As much as we all love the Starks it's easy to think of each Lord being like Ned.
Equating your average Stark lord to The Ned is a faulty deduction. Perhaps Robb or Jon might attempt to rule in that vein, but i see his forebears being much harder lords, with a less chivalraic and more eye for an eye sense of honor (fostering in the Vale being the difference for The Ned imo)...
Both Bran and Jon seem much further along in their warging than Robb ever got, especially after he started disconnecting from Grey Wind.
I think Robb didn't fight his wolfishness like Jon has (until the whole Westerling issue came up, where he followed the wrong heart), and the pass at the Golden Tooth shows a fairly advance warging capability. I think Robb was less strong as a warg than Bran and Jon, but i think he was just as advanced if not moreso than Jon...
I think Robb didn't fight his wolfishness like Jon has (until the whole Westerling issue came up, where he followed the wrong heart), and the pass at the Golden Tooth shows a fairly advance warging capability. I think Robb was less strong as a warg than Bran and Jon, but i think he was just as advanced if not moreso than Jon...
First up, love the avatar!
Second up--I agree Robb was well bonded and instructively warging Grey Wind.
But we also see him pull back from Grey Wind. We've no idea re: his wolf dreams. So, absolutely, he would have ended up powerful. But Jon and Bran just got the chance to go further, I think.
It is possible he's as scary as the NK, just in a more sadistic way. He reminds me of Loki...
Intersting. . . yes, a bit like Loki. But arguably less a trickster than a destroyer.
And his declaring his power over other gods. . . it reminds me of voice point re: the title Magnar. Used to mean "god" if I'm remembering right.
So, did the NIght's King declare himself a god, as did Euron? It would explain Nan's statement that he knew no fear.
All art is at once surface and symbol. Those who go beneath the surface do so at their peril. Those who read the symbol do so at their peril. It is the spectator, and not life, that art really mirrors. Oscar Wilde.
Second up--I agree Robb was well bonded and instructively warging Grey Wind.
But we also see him pull back from Grey Wind. We've no idea re: his wolf dreams. So, absolutely, he would have ended up powerful. But Jon and Bran just got the chance to go further, I think.
It is a shame that he didn't listen to his damn wolf instead of his man parts...
Intersting. . . yes, a bit like Loki. But arguably less a trickster than a destroyer.
And his declaring his power over other gods. . . it reminds me of voice point re: the title Magnar. Used to mean "god" if I'm remembering right.
So, did the NIght's King declare himself a god, as did Euron? It would explain Nan's statement that he knew no fear.
the show's depiction of the making of the first WW would lead against this argument, but the way the Night's King is talked about in the books it would seem likely this is the case...
And his declaring his power over other gods. . . it reminds me of voice point re: the title Magnar. Used to mean "god" if I'm remembering right.
Word.
A Storm of Swords - Jon II Jon had no answer for that. Small wonder that the Seven Kingdoms thought the free folk scarcely human. They have no laws, no honor, not even simple decency. They steal endlessly from each other, breed like beasts, prefer rape to marriage, and fill the world with baseborn children. Yet he was growing fond of Tormund Giantsbane, great bag of wind and lies though he was. Longspear as well. And Ygritte . . . no, I will not think about Ygritte. Along with the Tormunds and the Longspears rode other sorts of wildlings, though; men like Rattleshirt and the Weeper who would as soon slit you as spit on you. There was Harma Dogshead, a squat keg of a woman with cheeks like slabs of white meat, who hated dogs and killed one every fortnight to make a fresh head for her banner; earless Styr, Magnar of Thenn, whose own people thought him more god than lord; Varamyr Sixskins, a small mouse of a man whose steed was a savage white snow bear that stood thirteen feet tall on its hind legs. And wherever the bear and Varamyr went, three wolves and a shadowcat came following. Jon had been in his presence only once, and once had been enough; the mere sight of the man had made him bristle, even as the fur on the back of Ghost's neck had bristled at the sight of the bear and that long black-and-white 'cat.
A Storm of Swords - Jon III The Magnar of Thenn studied Jon with his chilly grey eyes. "We shall learn their numbers soon enough," he said after a moment. "Go. I will send for you if I have further questions." Jon bowed his head stiffly, and went. If all the wildlings were like Styr, it would be easier to betray them. The Thenns were not like other free folk, though. The Magnar claimed to be the last of the First Men, and ruled with an iron hand. His little land of Thenn was a high mountain valley hidden amongst the northernmost peaks of the Frostfangs, surrounded by cave dwellers, Hornfoot men, giants, and the cannibal clans of the ice rivers. Ygritte said the Thenns were savage fighters, and that their Magnar was a god to them. Jon could believe that. Unlike Jarl and Harma and Rattleshirt, Styr commanded absolute obedience from his men, and that discipline was no doubt part of why Mance had chosen him to go over the Wall.
Equating your average Stark lord to The Ned is a faulty deduction. Perhaps Robb or Jon might attempt to rule in that vein, but i see his forebears being much harder lords, with a less chivalraic and more eye for an eye sense of honor (fostering in the Vale being the difference for The Ned imo)...
I didn't articulate that well. Allow me to re-phrase....through the main series of books we get to know Starks as the "good guys" and it's easy to assume that their forefathers were like them. Though upon further reading and analysis we discover that then isn't the case.
the show's depiction of the making of the first WW would lead against this argument, but the way the Night's King is talked about in the books it would seem likely this is the case...
But if the Night's King, once transformed from a human, decided he was a god instead of just a warrior--might that not be a reason WHY he declared himself a god and/or had no fear? The transformation encouraged the notion?
If so, it might also explain the show's depiction, since it looks like the Children lost control of the Walkers. If the Walkers decided they were superior, that might be why the Children lost control, maybe?
The Other's are called Cold Gods so their leader would absolutely be a God-King.
AH!! Yes! Yes! That would fit. A lack of fear leading to a lack of reverence for life and those around you. And since the "old gods" seem largely to be the repository of collective memory in the trees, such gods require reverence for the past and for one's fellows.
But the cold gods, as Other, would have no such respect.
All art is at once surface and symbol. Those who go beneath the surface do so at their peril. Those who read the symbol do so at their peril. It is the spectator, and not life, that art really mirrors. Oscar Wilde.
Excellent work! Is she a makeup artist and/or costumer?
Nah, just a hobby. (she's got a bachelors in cyber security, and has been working in that field since the first of the year). Her and a friend got into the zombie walk makeup effects, and she went to cosmetology school back when we first got married, so she understands makeup pretty well.
good call on the reasoning, that hadn't crossed my mind. i was focused on the Night's queen legend from the books as an origin story (ahhh tunnelvision).
I didn't articulate that well. Allow me to re-phrase....through the main series of books we get to know Starks as the "good guys" and it's easy to assume that their forefathers were like them. Though upon further reading and analysis we discover that then isn't the case.
yup. we're on the same page. i've just seen a significant amount of this line of thinking and it is one of the few things that gets me to speak up. I get the feeling that there were things Brandon was told that Ned was never privy to, and had he known he'd never have accepted HotK... Starks weren't meant for trips south, and Ned is the only one to return from one...
Nah, just a hobby. (she's got a bachelors in cyber security, and has been working in that field since the first of the year). Her and a friend got into the zombie walk makeup effects, and she went to cosmetology school back when we first got married, so she understands makeup pretty well.
good call on the reasoning, that hadn't crossed my mind. i was focused on the Night's queen legend from the books as an origin story (ahhh tunnelvision).
I get the feeling that there were things Brandon was told that Ned was never privy to, and had he known he'd never have accepted HotK... Starks weren't meant for trips south, and Ned is the only one to return from one...
I could see this. Though it then makes be wonder why, if Brandon were told such things by his father, his father would still arrange southern marriages for his kids.
All art is at once surface and symbol. Those who go beneath the surface do so at their peril. Those who read the symbol do so at their peril. It is the spectator, and not life, that art really mirrors. Oscar Wilde.
I could see this. Though it then makes be wonder why, if Brandon were told such things by his father, his father would still arrange southern marriages for his kids.
i think it was fine to send second sons and daughters to the south, but there are bad things rising if both the lord and heir head that way... just a gut feeling that i have regarding the whole "there must always be a Stark in WF" adage's old meaning being less vague (meaning the King/Lord Stark and heir should ignore southron politics and not engage in them else the long night returns). Probably need to restock my tinfoil supply and all, but still just a gut feeling ive had since i first read the series...