Veeeeery interesting question. Maybe frailty is not a requirement for opening of the third eye in general, but maybe only frail individuals are "chosen" and trained, since they are easier to manipulate?
It Bran's physical state that drove him to find BR. His first question was about getting his legs back. He wouldn't have gone through all he did to be a greenseer if he was still in perfect physical condition. It's also possible that Bran's fall was necessary to keep him in WF. Otherwise he would have gone south where the weirwoods and Old Gods no longer exist.
The blade was Valyrian steel, spell-forged and dark as smoke. Nothing held an edge like Valyrian steel.
Is it possible that Euron is not a FAILED acolyte of the 3EC? Perhaps the 3E Crow is served by the Crow's Eye. Maybe Euron and Bran have committed similar abominations because that is part of their training. The many tentacles of the Eldritch horror that Euron serves could be the root system that he has become a part of.
Is there anything that we actually know about 3EC (or BR) that is inconsistent with Euron's vision and direction? When Euron is surrounded by skulls and tentacles, we expect Cthulu, but when Bran is surrounded by skulls and tentacles, we think Scooby Doo is around somewhere, or we expect it to lead to positive insight and self-actualization. 3EC may be trying to hold back the forces of darkness, but he may be bringing them. And even if he is on the side of the angels, he may be willing to use any tool at hand.
Is it possible that Euron is not a FAILED acolyte of the 3EC? Perhaps the 3E Crow is served by the Crow's Eye. Maybe Euron and Bran have committed similar abominations because that is part of their training. The many tentacles of the Eldritch horror that Euron serves could be the root system that he has become a part of.
Is there anything that we actually know about 3EC (or BR) that is inconsistent with Euron's vision and direction? When Euron is surrounded by skulls and tentacles, we expect Cthulu, but when Bran is surrounded by skulls and tentacles, we think Scooby Doo is around somewhere, or we expect it to lead to positive insight and self-actualization. 3EC may be trying to hold back the forces of darkness, but he may be bringing them. And even if he is on the side of the angels, he may be willing to use any tool at hand.
You bring up some very interesting questions. IMO it's the consistent observation that "Euron's gifts are poisoned" that tells me he's up to no good. Nothing of that nature has been said about Bran yet (I reserve the right to back-peddle should he continue to skin change Hodor).
On the bolded we completely agree. It's my opinion that he sent the Dragon Dream to Dany bc he wants to use her and her dragons to fight the Others. This would go against the plan of the CotF bc the destruction caused by unleashing the dragons would be too great and would counterproductive to any possible salvation. BR is thinking short-term bc "the hours is late" whereas the CotF have long-term goals.
The blade was Valyrian steel, spell-forged and dark as smoke. Nothing held an edge like Valyrian steel.
Nothing of that nature has been said about Bran yet
I would not characterize Bran as evil at this point. Although possession is evil, the warging of Hodor has been under such desperate circumstances that I would call it morally ambiguous. So I am not saying Bran is evil, I am saying it is a mistake to assume BR wants to shape Bran into something 'good'
Bran is clearly largely ignorant here. 3EC's purposes are largely unknown to him (and to us). If 3EC is conspiring with the Others or serving some destructive Eldritch power, Bran doesn't know that yet. If 3EC has a plan to prevent the long night, or bring peace, or save humanity, we don't know that yet
So I am not saying Bran is evil, I am saying it is a mistake to assume BR wants to shape Bran into something 'good'
I think he just wants to use him and doesn't care what it costs Bran. He may even know about mind-raping Hodor but won't say anything so as not to risk loosing his apprentice.
The blade was Valyrian steel, spell-forged and dark as smoke. Nothing held an edge like Valyrian steel.
Is it possible that Euron is not a FAILED acolyte of the 3EC? Perhaps the 3E Crow is served by the Crow's Eye. Maybe Euron and Bran have committed similar abominations because that is part of their training. The many tentacles of the Eldritch horror that Euron serves could be the root system that he has become a part of.
Is there anything that we actually know about 3EC (or BR) that is inconsistent with Euron's vision and direction? When Euron is surrounded by skulls and tentacles, we expect Cthulu, but when Bran is surrounded by skulls and tentacles, we think Scooby Doo is around somewhere, or we expect it to lead to positive insight and self-actualization. 3EC may be trying to hold back the forces of darkness, but he may be bringing them. And even if he is on the side of the angels, he may be willing to use any tool at hand.
Oooooh I like the way you think! BR had quite a dark reputation back when he was a normal human (if ever he was such a thing), as did his lover Shiera Seastar. He, among other things, promised one of the Blackfyres (Daemon III?) safe passage, but when he arrived he had him executed. It's not clear whether they shared bread and salt, so it may not have been an official guest right violation, but it certainly was kinslaying and murder. That's why Aegon V sent him to the Wall. He is also a NW deserter, and not just any old deserter, but a Lord Commander who ran off.
Then there is the question of history being written by the victors. Here is the WB description of the start of the Blackfyre rebellion:
Bitter his steel may have been, but worse was his tongue. He spilled poison in Daemon’s ear, and with him came the clamoring of other knights and lords with grievances. In the end, years of such talk bore their fruit, and Daemon Blackfyre made his decision. Yet it was a decision he made rashly, for word soon reached King Daeron that Blackfyre meant to declare himself king within the turn of the moon. (We do not know how word came to Daeron, though Merion’s unfinished The Red Dragon and the Black suggests that another of the Great Bastards, Brynden Rivers, was involved.) The king sent the Kingsguard to arrest Daemon before he could take his plans for treason any further. Daemon was forewarned, and with the help of the famously hottempered knight Ser Quentyn Ball, called Fireball, he was able to escape the Red Keep safely. Daemon Blackfyre’s allies used this attempted arrest as a cause for war, claiming that Daeron had acted against Daemon out of no more than baseless fear. Others still named him Daeron Falseborn, repeating the calumny that Aegon the Unworthy himself was said to have circulated in the later years of his reign: that he had been sired not by the king but by his brother, the Dragonknight. In this manner did the First Blackfyre Rebellion begin, in the year 196 AC.
BR's actions here remind me of Littlefinger: how easy would it be to feed the king's fear of a half brother that he already felt threatened by? How easy to start a war with just a whispered word? We know that BR and Bittersteel both wanted Shiera, and Barristan seems to think this rivalry was to blame for the war that followed. This seems very possible to me, making BR an even darker figure than he already was.
There was also the Great Spring Sickness, which many blamed on BR. Here is its end:
But then the Great Spring Sickness swept the Seven Kingdoms, affecting all save the Vale and Dorne, where they closed the ports and mountain passes. Worst hit of all was King’s Landing. The High Septon, the Seven’s voice on earth, died, as did a third of the Most Devout, and nearly all the silent sisters in the city. Corpses were piled in the ruins of the Dragonpit until they stood ten feet high and, in the end, Bloodraven had the pyromancers burn the corpses where they lay. A quarter of the city went up in flames along with them, but there was nothing else to be done.
This would have been quite the blood sacrifice, no? Not to mention that a quarter of the city being burned down is stated so matter of factly... But oh look, after the Great Spring Sickness, the king that took over named a new Hand...:
Donning the crown during the Great Spring Sickness, Aerys I faced a realm in turmoil from the first. Hardly had the plague begun to ebb when Dagon Greyjoy, Lord of the Iron Islands, sent ironborn ships reaving all up and down the shores of the Sunset Sea, whilst across the narrow sea Bittersteel plotted with the sons of Daemon Blackfyre. Perhaps it was because of these difficulties that Aerys turned to Brynden Rivers to serve as his Hand.
Funny how that worked out.
Bloodraven proved to be a capable Hand, but also a master of whisperers who rivaled Lady Misery, and there were those who thought he and his half sister and paramour, Shiera Seastar, used sorcery to ferret out secrets. It became common to refer to his “thousand eyes and one,” and men both high and low began to distrust their neighbor for fear of their being a spy in Bloodraven’s employ.
In summary: capable but creepy, and sowing distrust among his people.
We have NO reason to assume that he has good intentions.
“In Qohor he is the Black Goat, in Yi Ti the Lion of Night, in Westeros the Stranger. All men must bow to him in the end, no matter if they worship the Seven or the Lord of Light, the Moon Mother or the Drowned God or the Great Shepherd. All mankind belongs to him... else somewhere in the world would be a folk who lived forever. Do you know of any folk who live forever?”
I think it does. IMO Bran needed get hurt and slip into a coma in order to rush his training. Summer (CotF) tried to warn him. Jojen started having greendreams after a bout a Greywater Fever. They're vulnerable. I can't help but wonder if it's their physical frailty that makes them so easy to manipulate, I mean teach.
Veeeeery interesting question. Maybe frailty is not a requirement for opening of the third eye in general, but maybe only frail individuals are "chosen" and trained, since they are easier to manipulate?
And it ties in with prestonjacobs idea re: Sweetrobin: that he's hearing the voices of the souls trapped in his weirwood throne in the Eyrie. And the voices stop waking him when he's off of the mountain.
If all of that holds, the petrified weirwood of Nagga's Bones could also have souls in them. And thus potentially send voices and visions.
Especially the frail and frightened.
All art is at once surface and symbol. Those who go beneath the surface do so at their peril. Those who read the symbol do so at their peril. It is the spectator, and not life, that art really mirrors. Oscar Wilde.
And it ties in with prestonjacobs idea re: Sweetrobin: that he's hearing the voices of the souls trapped in his weirwood throne in the Eyrie. And the voices stop waking him when he's off of the mountain.
If all of that holds, the petrified weirwood of Nagga's Bones could also have souls in them. And thus potentially send voices and visions.
Especially the frail and frightened.
I had not heard that one. I like it! Could Nagga's Bones be the source of the Drowned Gods voice Damphair was hearing?
The blade was Valyrian steel, spell-forged and dark as smoke. Nothing held an edge like Valyrian steel.
IMO Bran needed get hurt and slip into a coma in order to rush his training. Summer (CotF) tried to warn him. Jojen started having greendreams after a bout a Greywater Fever. They're vulnerable. I can't help but wonder if it's their physical frailty that makes them so easy to manipulate, I mean teach.
I agree; whilst i could not find an explicit mention of Bran being feverish after his fall, he is incapacitated by his coma; Jojen would have also been in the same situation due to his greywater fever, from which he almost died. Both in lengthy and dire predicament.
Not the case with Euron?
"Arya did not dare take a bath, even though she smelled as bad as Yoren by now, all sour and stinky. Some of the creatures living in her clothes had come all the way from Flea Bottom with her; it didn’t seem right to drown them."
I agree; whilst i could not find an explicit mention of Bran being feverish after his fall, he is incapacitated by his coma; Jojen would have also been in the same situation due to his greywater fever, from which he almost died. Both in lengthy and dire predicament.
Not the case with Euron?
I don't think he was ever called feverish specifically and I doubt he was given his injury. In Bran's case the coma was a long period where he could communicate with the 3EC without interruption. I suspect Jojen's illness meant he was sleeping for at least a few days.
My theory is somewhat dependent on Euron actually having some sort of affliction with his eye. He wears a patch over it and it's a different color than the other. Was it physically injured? That's unknown. What is known is that Euron and Brandon Rivers both have conditions that affect production of the melanin in their bodies. If that alone was good enough for BR than it should be good enough for Euron.
The blade was Valyrian steel, spell-forged and dark as smoke. Nothing held an edge like Valyrian steel.
Do we have a clear answer yet for why Aeron always seems to think about Urri when thinking about Euron?
AFAIK the details surrounding Urri's death are he died of infection after playing the axe throwing game and they blamed it on the maester. But Areon seems to link Urri and Euron, and I got the distinct impression that Euron was responsible for Urri's death. And I am trying to reconcile this.
Did Euron warg Aeron and then attack Urri and kill him?
Do we have a clear answer yet for why Aeron always seems to think about Urri when thinking about Euron?
AFAIK the details surrounding Urri's death are he died of infection after playing the axe throwing game and they blamed it on the maester. But Areon seems to link Urri and Euron, and I got the distinct impression that Euron was responsible for Urri's death. And I am trying to reconcile this.
Did Euron warg Aeron and then attack Urri and kill him?
Clear answer? No. Suspicions? Ohh yeah! I suspect that Euron wore the skin of Urri to rape Aeron and vice versa. As to his role in Urri's death, I cannot say. But I can't rule out the possibility either.
The blade was Valyrian steel, spell-forged and dark as smoke. Nothing held an edge like Valyrian steel.
Do we have a clear answer yet for why Aeron always seems to think about Urri when thinking about Euron?
AFAIK the details surrounding Urri's death are he died of infection after playing the axe throwing game and they blamed it on the maester. But Areon seems to link Urri and Euron, and I got the distinct impression that Euron was responsible for Urri's death. And I am trying to reconcile this.
Did Euron warg Aeron and then attack Urri and kill him?
I think Aeron links Euron and Urri b/c Aeron and Urri lived together in a tower room, and Euron would come up there and rape them. So they were victims together, of Euron.
I don't think Euron killed Urri though. First, he asks Aeron "did you pray that I would choose you, or that I would pass you by?". This doesn't sound like he warged one and raped the other. It sounds like on any given night, one was the victim, and the other got lucky that night and was passed by. Also, Euron admits to killing three brothers, and Urri isn't one of them. Why would he leave him out?
Speaking of the infection though... it may be possible that Urri wanted to die b/c of what Euron was doing to him, and either failed at the axe game on purpose, or somehow contaminated his own wound, didn't take his meds, etc. And maybe Aeron knows... maybe Aeron knew and he let him do it b/c he understood?
“In Qohor he is the Black Goat, in Yi Ti the Lion of Night, in Westeros the Stranger. All men must bow to him in the end, no matter if they worship the Seven or the Lord of Light, the Moon Mother or the Drowned God or the Great Shepherd. All mankind belongs to him... else somewhere in the world would be a folk who lived forever. Do you know of any folk who live forever?”
I don't think Euron killed Urri though. First, he asks Aeron "did you pray that I would choose you, or that I would pass you by?". This doesn't sound like he warged one and raped the other. It sounds like on any given night, one was the victim, and the other got lucky that night and was passed by.
I originally thought of the skinchanging bc of the vision Aeron has of Urri's face sloughing off to reveal Euron's. The raping was only solidified for me in the Balticon chapter. I hated to believe it until then. So to me the options are... 1) He just skinchaged them 2) He raped them and skin changed them on separate occasions. 3) He did both simultaneously.
The blade was Valyrian steel, spell-forged and dark as smoke. Nothing held an edge like Valyrian steel.
I don't think Euron killed Urri though. First, he asks Aeron "did you pray that I would choose you, or that I would pass you by?". This doesn't sound like he warged one and raped the other. It sounds like on any given night, one was the victim, and the other got lucky that night and was passed by.
I originally thought of the skinchanging bc of the vision Aeron has of Urri's face sloughing off to reveal Euron's. The raping was only solidified for me in the Balticon chapter. I hated to believe it until then. So to me the options are... 1) He just skinchaged them 2) He raped them and skin changed them on separate occasions. 3) He did both simultaneously.
I am really with you on #3. It would explain so much. I think that's a big part of the start in him abusing his powers in order to strengthen them. What better way than to commit multiple abominations at once. This would check off at least three. Incest. Wearing the skin of a human and having sex as the skinchanged "animal."
Why must I always be the isle of crazy alone in an ocean of sensibility? The should to everybody else’s shouldn’t? The I-will to their better-nots?